book thread

Quence

Karl Marx left his wife and children in poverty
EDF2 Survivor
i'm sitting in a country with congress n senate full of stockholders in industries they keep voting to subsidize
Arguably even worse is many of those same politicians are allowing millions upon millions of foreigners to enter the country and compete with native born Americans for jobs.

Thus, the congressional moguls are keeping their large equity portfolios fat and sassy as corporations don’t feel any need to raise wages and their profit margins continue to expand.
 

chuj

A regular degenerate; lowest of the low
Janny
Returning to to our discussion of Nietzsche @Barrabas i think i got lucky with the translation since Zarathustra got translated into polish by a guy who actually knew german fluently and wrote a book on Nietzsche https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wacław_Berent.
Although he did have few... interesting takes, literally opening the foreword with "Nietzsche hailed from a family of germanized polish aryans" and going on about how his slavic soul was probably tortured in german school system lol.
Very common during that time as poles had something of a catholic revival, Parandowski author of the definite work on greek mythology in polish couldn't go 10 pages without remarking how greatly the greek customs mingled with christian thought and how they were the "perfect soil for christianity to grow in".
 

Barrabas

Newfag
EDF2 Survivor
For the sake of posterity, I will repost Walter Kaufmann's scathing intro to his Zarathustra intro from 1978, before which it was basically impossible to discuss the book in English. I will also remention American proto-chuds Leopold and Loeb, who very stupidly basically tried to LARP as Raskolnikov on the basis of the garbage translations available, and also because they missed the memo that Fred was a Dostoevsky fan. Sounds a lot like Poland had it's own sort of version of that in Berent, which is nice. Emotes, bolds and italics are added by me for emphasis obviously. Full sauce of Kaufmann's Portable Nietzsche, which includes the entirety Zarathustra:

This overflowing sense of humor, which prefers even a
poor joke to no joke at all, runs counter to the popular
images of Nietzsche—not only to the grim creation of his
sister, but also to the piteous portrait of Stefan Zweig, who
was, in this respect, still too much under the influence of
Bertram’s Nietzsche: Attempt at a Mythology. Nietzsche
had the sense of humor which Stefan George and his min-
ions, very much including Bertram, lacked; and if Zara-
thustra occasionally excels George’s austere prophetic
affectation, he soon laughs at his own failings and punctures
his pathos, like Heine, whom George hated. The puncture,
however, does not give the impression of diffident self-con-
sciousness and a morbid fear of self-betrayal, but rather
of that Dionysian exuberance which Zarathustra celebrates.

Nietzsche’s fate in the English-speaking world has been
rather unkind, in spite of, or pérhaps even in some measure
because of, the ebullient enthusiasm of some of the early
English and American Nietzscheans. He has rarely been
accorded that perceptive understanding which is relatively
common among the French. And when we look back today,
one of the main reasons must be sought in the inadequacies
of some of the early translations, particularly of Zarathus-
tra. For one thing, they completely misrepresent the mood
of the original—beginning, but unfortunately not ending,
with their many unjustified archaisms, their “thou” and
“ye” with the clumsy attendant verb forms, and their
whole misguided effort to approximate the King James
Bible. As if Zarathustra’s attacks on the spirit of gravity
and his praise of “light feet” were not among the leitmotifs
of the book! In fact, this alone makes the work bearable.

To be sure, Zarathustra abounds in allusions to the
Bible, most of them highly irreverent, but just these have
been missed for the most part by Thomas Common. His
version, nevertheless, was considered a sufficient improve-
ment over Alexander Tille’s earlier attempt to merit in-
clusion in the “Authorized English Translation of the Com-
plete Works”; and while some of Common’s other efforts
were supplanted by slightly better translations, his Zara-
thustra survived, faute de mieux. For that matter, the book
comes close to being untranslatable.

What is one to do with Nietzsche’s constant plays on
words? Say, in der rechten Wissen-Gewissenschaft gibt es
nichts grosses und nichts kleines. This can probably be
salvaged only for the eye, not for the ear, with “the con-
science of science.” But then almost anything would be
better than Common’s “true knowing-knowledge.” Such
passages, and there are many, make us wonder whether he

had little German and less English.
( :owned: )

More often than not,he either overlooks a play on words or misunderstands it,
and in both cases makes nonsense of Nietzsche. What is
the point, to give a final example, of Nietzsche’s derision
of German writing, once “plain language” is substituted
for “German”? One can sympathize with the translator,
but one cannot understand or discuss Nietzsche on the basis
of the versions hitherto available.

The problems encountered in translating Zarathustra are
tremendous. Where Nietzsche does not deliberately bypass
idioms in favor of coinages, he makes fun of them—now
by taking them literally, then again by varying them
slightly. Here too he is a dedicated enemy of all conven-
tion, intent on exposing the stupidity and arbitrariness of
custom. This linguistic iconoclasm greatly impressed Chris-
tian Morgenstern and helped to inspire his celebrated
Galgenlieder, in which similar aims are pursued more sys-
tematically.

Nietzsche, like Morgenstern a generation later, even
creates a new animal when he speaks of Pébel-Schwind-
hunde. Windhund means grevhound but, more to the point,
is often used to designate a person without brains or char-
acter. Yet Wind, the wind, is celebrated in this passage,
and so the first part of the animal’s name had to be varied
to underline the opprobrium. What kind of animal should
the translator create? A weathercock is the same sort of
person as a Windhund (he turns with the wind) and per-
mits the coinage of blether-cock. Hardly a major triumph,
but few works of world literature can rival Zarathustra in
its abundance of coinages, some of them clearly prompted
by the feeling that the worst coinage is still better than the
best cliché. And this lightheartedness is an essential aspect
of Nietzsche.

Many of Nietzsche’s plays on words are, of course, ex-
tremely suggestive. To give one example among scores,
there is his play on Eheschliessen, Ehebrechen, Ehe-biegen,
Ehe-liigen, in section 24 of “Old and New Tablets.” Here
the old translations did not even try, and it is surely scant
compensation when Common gratuitously introduces, else-
where in the book, “sumpter asses and assesses” or coins
“baddest” in a passage in which Nietzsche says “most evil.”
In fact, Nietzsche devoted one-third of his Genealogy of
Morals to his distinction between “bad” and “evil.”

The poems in Zarathustra present a weird blend of pas-
sion and whimsy, but the difference between “Oh, every-
thing human is strange” and “O human hubbub, thou
wonderful thing!” in the hitherto standard translation is
still considerable. Or consider the fate of two perfectly
straightforward lines at the end of “The Song of Melan-
choly”: “That I should banned be/From all the trueness$”
And two chapters later Common gives us these lines:


"How it, to a dance-girl, like,
Doth bow and bend and on its haunches bob,
—One doth it too, when one view’th it long!— "

and in fact, Common still doth it in the next chapter :facepalm: :


“How it bobbeth, the blessed one, the home-returning one, in its
purple saddles!”

It may be ungracious, though hardly un-Nietzschean, to
ridicule such faults. But in the English-speaking world,
Zarathustra has been read, written about, and discussed
for decades on the basis of such travesties, and most criti-
cisms of the style have no relevance whatever to the
original. A few thrusts at those who exposed Nietzsche to
so many thrusts may therefore be defensible—in defense of
Nietzsche.

For that matter, the new translation here offered cer-
tainly does not do justice to him either. Probably no trans-
lation could; and perhaps the faults of his predecessors are
really a comfort to the translator who can ask to have his
work compared with theirs as well as with the original.
Or is the spirit of Zarathustra with its celebration of laugh-
ter contagious? After all, most of the plays on words have
no ulterior motive whatever. Must we have a justification
for laughing?

Much of what is most untranslatable is an expression of
that Ubermut which Nietzsche associates with the Uber-
mensch: a lightness of mind, a prankish exuberance—
though the term can also designate that overbearing which
the Greeks called hybris. In any case, such plays on words
must be kept in translation: how else is the reader to know
which remarks are inspired primarily by the possibility of
a pun or a daring rhyme? And robbed of its rapidly shifting
style, clothed in archaic solemnity, Zarathustra would be-
come a different work—like Faulkner done into the King’s
English. Nietzsche’s writing, too, is occasionally downright
bad, but at its best—superb.
 

edge_beta

Master lvl Taig
EDF2 Survivor
fierce-Valor-hi-res.webp


a very interesting biography of easy company's last(and longest) commander. full of details about "sparky" not mentioned in the hbo series, like how he was born in scotland, served in korea and laos, and finally retiring from the miltary after being a planning officer in the pentagon. And yes he did execute german pows, and a drunk sgt in his platoon :) Well worth a read.
 

minty

runs bartertown
finished the nietzsche n called it a day for the philosophy.
listened to faust after that and it was the most delightful audiobook so far, with king in yellow second. it was a full dramatization n had a choir it was just lovely... until like the last minute or so when despite selling his soul to the devil, communing with witches, ordering a church burned down, etc... he goes to heaven. i had never read or seen faust before (usually a play, i'm guessing? hence the dramatization) but is "audibly mild regret near the end" all it takes to get into heaven? anyways, 9/10 would see live play of n walk out near the end.
desiring more quality, i looked at the audiobook brand n other works are 50-150 bucks. while significantly better than free ai narrated slop, paying for an audiobook's set designers is not the fiscal choice my life needs rn

next listened to some kafka. there is an alternate reality where men's "literally me" memes are of gregor samsa n i want to live there

listened to "the turn of the screw" by henry james and it was hot garbage, but an author i had not read before so a coin toss is a coin toss

to be cont.
 

Lovecraft

Dramacrat
Spent all day at the office since I had a violently upset stomach and couldn't be arsed to haul my arse to a project site.
So inbetween make-work tasks I read through an English translation of Gylfaginning on Völuspá.org
As always I am saddened that so much of Norse mythology has been lost to time and the machinations of jewish meme contamination, and I encourage you all to write to your government representatives to demand funding for further time-travel research so that we can finally send agents back to exterminate their roots in the year zogg roughly 4000 years ago and nip this nonsense in the bud.
 
finished the nietzsche n called it a day for the philosophy.
listened to faust after that and it was the most delightful audiobook so far, with king in yellow second. it was a full dramatization n had a choir it was just lovely... until like the last minute or so when despite selling his soul to the devil, communing with witches, ordering a church burned down, etc... he goes to heaven. i had never read or seen faust before (usually a play, i'm guessing? hence the dramatization) but is "audibly mild regret near the end" all it takes to get into heaven? anyways, 9/10 would see live play of n walk out near the end.
desiring more quality, i looked at the audiobook brand n other works are 50-150 bucks. while significantly better than free ai narrated slop, paying for an audiobook's set designers is not the fiscal choice my life needs rn

next listened to some kafka. there is an alternate reality where men's "literally me" memes are of gregor samsa n i want to live there

listened to "the turn of the screw" by henry james and it was hot garbage, but an author i had not read before so a coin toss is a coin toss

to be cont.
I keep meaning to read Beyond Good And Evil.
 

chuj

A regular degenerate; lowest of the low
Janny
Spent all day at the office since I had a violently upset stomach and couldn't be arsed to haul my arse to a project site.
So inbetween make-work tasks I read through an English translation of Gylfaginning on Völuspá.org
As always I am saddened that so much of Norse mythology has been lost to time and the machinations of jewish meme contamination, and I encourage you all to write to your government representatives to demand funding for further time-travel research so that we can finally send agents back to exterminate their roots in the year zogg roughly 4000 years ago and nip this nonsense in the bud.
irish monks wrote down your legends for you snowman
if it was romans in their stead they would burn down your temples and erect a giant penis dedicated to saturn where once sacred grove of Þórr stood
 

Lovecraft

Dramacrat
irish monks wrote down your legends for you snowman
if it was romans in their stead they would burn down your temples and erect a giant penis dedicated to saturn where once sacred grove of Þórr stood
The majority of longform was compiled by Snorri Sturluson from written and some scaldic sources in Ísland.
The romans would have been preferable over the jewish plague. If only Hadrian had finished the job in 136 CE
 

lurk

Dramacrat
EDF2 Survivor
The majority of longform was compiled by Snorri Sturluson from written and some scaldic sources in Ísland.
The romans would have been preferable over the jewish plague. If only Hadrian had finished the job in 136 CE
when are you joining one of the viking churches?
 

Quence

Karl Marx left his wife and children in poverty
EDF2 Survivor
Spent all day at the office since I had a violently upset stomach
Remember to cook the breakfast cod before eating it. I know it’s difficult to not instantly want to devour that Gadus Morhua (Atlantic cod), but the trematodes, nematodes and other parasites can make a Soywegian quite ill….as you found out.
 
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